[frers-list]questions on a purchase of a frers 33
Dan Boyd
frers-list@lists.frers33.com
Fri, 3 Feb 2006 15:38:39 -0500
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WildThing is MFG in 1988.
Dan Boyd
Biogen Idec Inc
Tel: 1.617.679.2274
Fax: 1.617.679.3599
"Albert, Francis X CIV SEA 01" <francis.albert@navy.mil>=20
Sent by: frers-list-admin@lists.frers33.com
02/03/2006 03:14 PM
Please respond to
frers-list@lists.frers33.com
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Subject
RE: [frers-list]questions on a purchase of a frers 33
Alright big question is where all these boats made the same and if anyone=20
knows of a different version. Allen your boat was number 14 what year was =
your boat built? Wild thing was number 37 and may have been built in the=20
same year as mine.
=20
Thanks,
Frank Albert
=20
-----Original Message-----
From: frers-list-admin@lists.frers33.com=20
[mailto:frers-list-admin@lists.frers33.com]On Behalf Of Albert, Francis X=20
CIV SEA 01
Sent: Friday, February 03, 2006 7:09
To: frers-list@lists.frers33.com
Subject: RE: [frers-list]questions on a purchase of a frers 33
=20
Bob,
=20
My boat may have that new crack problem. I noticed last summer water=20
getting in to the bilge area. This fall when they hauled the boat there=20
was a crack right at the top of the keel right at where you would suppose=20
the keel to hull joint would be (however, in one of these discussions=20
someone mentioned the actual hull is lower, down the keel like about 10 to =
12 inches) and water from the bilge was seeping out. That lower hull=20
thing seems pretty strange and my yard says the keel and hull joint are=20
right at that crack. Their suggestion for this year is to snug up the=20
keel bolts and then grind out the crack and fill it with 5200, fairing it=20
using alcohol. They said if that doesn't work then next year they will=20
remove the bolts and lift the boat off the keel by about 3 inches. Their=20
experience with this process has taught them a couple of things. First=20
most boats had the keels joined to the hull just this way with a ton of=20
5200 spread over the entire top of the keel. Second, 5200 really does not =
want to let go. They've had boats in the lift like this for four hours=20
with the only thing holding the keel up being the 5200.
=20
If anyone has had a similar experience I'd like to hear about it.
=20
Thanks,
Frank Albert
=20
=20
=20
-----Original Message-----
From: frers-list-admin@lists.frers33.com=20
[mailto:frers-list-admin@lists.frers33.com]On Behalf Of Allan Heyward
Sent: Thursday, February 02, 2006 12:03
To: frers-list@lists.frers33.com
Subject: RE: [frers-list]questions on a purchase of a frers 33
=20
Bob
=20
I have a 1987 Frers 33 that sails and races on the Chesapeake Bay. I?ve=20
read Frank?s response on your question 4 and only have a couple of things=20
to add, based on my experience:
=20
The construction of the transverse stringer leaves a void below the=20
stringer that extends to the leading edge of the keel sump to which the=20
keel is bolted at the point of transition into the hull. I don?t know for =
certain if this will be true on all boats, as I understand some may not=20
have wood in the stringers, but where it exists, it creates a potential=20
structural weak point. If the leading edge of the keel at the hull shows=20
separation you will get a leak that will not only contribute to=20
deterioration of the wood stringer, but provides a path to the bilge: the=20
reason is that you are not seeing separation between keel and hull, but a=20
crack in the sump which, over time and load can create a tear in the hull. =
This is one reason a fix from the inside is desirable and that you should =
look carefully at the leading edge of the keel at the hull. The fix is=20
not as traumatic as the problem sounds. The other thing to check is the=20
keel bolts for deep crevice corrosion, as on at least one boat (mine)=20
there was a mismatch between stainless in the bolts and nuts that caused=20
substantial erosion of several of the keel bolts.
=20
Other than that, the boat is strong as an ox and a delight to sail and=20
race.
=20
Allan M. Heyward, Jr.
COOK, HEYWARD, LEE, HOPPER & FEEHAN, P.C.
804-747-4500
=20
-----Original Message-----
From: frers-list-admin@lists.frers33.com=20
[mailto:frers-list-admin@lists.frers33.com] On Behalf Of Stephen, Robert
Sent: Wednesday, February 01, 2006 7:02 AM
To: frers-list@lists.frers33.com
Subject: [frers-list]questions on a purchase of a frers 33
=20
I am currently interested in purchasing a frers 33.
=20
1) Can anyone update me as to where any specific coring issues in=20
hull or the deck area that might be consistent with most of these boats?
2) If I wanted to change out the wheel steering to a tiller is this=20
reasonable or does the installation look like a morphidite?
3) Any questionable electrical to look for?
4) Any concern on the design as it relates to the keel to hull=20
design or attachment. Separate from a bad grounding.
=20
=20
I live in the Chicago area
Thanks for any advice or information anyone can offer on ?what to look=20
for?
=20
Bob
=20
=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=
=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=
=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=
=5F=5F
CONFIDENTIALITY NOTE:
This Weber-Stephen Products Company e-mail is intended only for
the use of the individual or entity to which it is addressed and may
contain information that is privileged, confidential and exempt from
disclosure under applicable law. If the reader of this e-mail message
is not the intended recipient, or the employee or agent responsible
for delivery of the message to the intended recipient, you are hereby
notified that any dissemination, distribution or copying of this
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<br><font size=3D2 face=3D"sans-serif">WildThing is MFG in 1988.</font>
<br>
<br><font size=3D2 face=3D"sans-serif">Dan Boyd<br>
Biogen Idec Inc<br>
Tel: 1.617.679.2274<br>
Fax: 1.617.679.3599<br>
</font>
<br>
<br>
<br>
<table width=3D100%>
<tr valign=3Dtop>
<td width=3D40%><font size=3D1 face=3D"sans-serif"><b>"Albert, Francis=
X
CIV SEA 01" <francis.albert@navy.mil></b> </font>
<br><font size=3D1 face=3D"sans-serif">Sent by: frers-list-admin@lists.frer=
s33.com</font>
<p><font size=3D1 face=3D"sans-serif">02/03/2006 03:14 PM</font>
<table border>
<tr valign=3Dtop>
<td bgcolor=3Dwhite>
<div align=3Dcenter><font size=3D1 face=3D"sans-serif">Please respond to<br>
frers-list@lists.frers33.com</font></div></table>
<p><font size=3D1 face=3D"sans-serif">Message Size: <b>32.4 KB</b></font>
<td width=3D59%>
<table width=3D100%>
<tr valign=3Dtop>
<td>
<div align=3Dright><font size=3D1 face=3D"sans-serif">To</font></div>
<td><font size=3D1 face=3D"sans-serif"><frers-list@lists.frers33.com>=
</font>
<tr valign=3Dtop>
<td>
<div align=3Dright><font size=3D1 face=3D"sans-serif">cc</font></div>
<td>
<tr valign=3Dtop>
<td>
<div align=3Dright><font size=3D1 face=3D"sans-serif">Subject</font></div>
<td><font size=3D1 face=3D"sans-serif">RE: [frers-list]questions on a purch=
ase
of a frers 33</font></table>
<br>
<table>
<tr valign=3Dtop>
<td>
<td></table>
<br></table>
<br>
<br>
<br><font size=3D2 color=3D#993366 face=3D"Arial">Alright big question is w=
here
all these boats made the same and if anyone knows of a different version.
Allen your boat was number 14 what year was your boat built? Wi=
ld
thing was number 37 and may have been built in the same year as mine.</font>
<p><font size=3D2 color=3D#993366 face=3D"Arial"> </font>
<p><font size=3D2 color=3D#993366 face=3D"Arial">Thanks,</font>
<p><font size=3D2 color=3D#993366 face=3D"Arial">Frank Albert</font>
<p><font size=3D2 color=3D#993366 face=3D"Arial"> </font>
<p><font size=3D2 face=3D"Tahoma">-----Original Message-----<b><br>
From:</b> frers-list-admin@lists.frers33.com [mailto:frers-list-admin@lists=
.frers33.com]<b>On
Behalf Of </b>Albert, Francis X CIV SEA 01<b><br>
Sent:</b> Friday, February 03, 2006 7:09<b><br>
To:</b> frers-list@lists.frers33.com<b><br>
Subject:</b> RE: [frers-list]questions on a purchase of a frers 33</font>
<p><font size=3D3 face=3D"Times New Roman"> </font>
<p><font size=3D2 color=3D#000080 face=3D"Arial">Bob,</font>
<p><font size=3D2 color=3D#000080 face=3D"Arial"> </font>
<p><font size=3D2 color=3D#000080 face=3D"Arial">My boat may have that new =
crack
problem. I noticed last summer water getting in to the bilge area.
This fall when they hauled the boat there was a crack right at the
top of the keel right at where you would suppose the keel to hull joint
would be (however, in one of these discussions someone mentioned the actual
hull is lower, down the keel like about 10 to 12 inches) and water from
the bilge was seeping out. That lower hull thing seems pretty strange
and my yard says the keel and hull joint are right at that crack. The=
ir
suggestion for this year is to snug up the keel bolts and then grind out
the crack and fill it with 5200, fairing it using alcohol. They
said if that doesn't work then next year they will remove the bolts and
lift the boat off the keel by about 3 inches. Their experience with
this process has taught them a couple of things. First most boats
had the keels joined to the hull just this way with a ton of 5200 spread
over the entire top of the keel. Second, 5200 really does not want
to let go. They've had boats in the lift like this for four hours
with the only thing holding the keel up being the 5200.</font>
<p><font size=3D2 color=3D#000080 face=3D"Arial"> </font>
<p><font size=3D2 color=3D#000080 face=3D"Arial">If anyone has had a similar
experience I'd like to hear about it.</font>
<p><font size=3D2 color=3D#000080 face=3D"Arial"> </font>
<p><font size=3D2 color=3D#000080 face=3D"Arial">Thanks,</font>
<p><font size=3D2 color=3D#000080 face=3D"Arial">Frank Albert</font>
<p><font size=3D2 color=3D#000080 face=3D"Arial"> </font>
<p><font size=3D2 color=3D#000080 face=3D"Arial"> </font>
<p><font size=3D2 color=3D#000080 face=3D"Arial"> </font>
<p><font size=3D2 face=3D"Tahoma">-----Original Message-----<b><br>
From:</b> frers-list-admin@lists.frers33.com [mailto:frers-list-admin@lists=
.frers33.com]<b>On
Behalf Of </b>Allan Heyward<b><br>
Sent:</b> Thursday, February 02, 2006 12:03<b><br>
To:</b> frers-list@lists.frers33.com<b><br>
Subject:</b> RE: [frers-list]questions on a purchase of a frers 33</font>
<p><font size=3D3 face=3D"Times New Roman"> </font>
<p><font size=3D2 color=3D#000080 face=3D"Arial">Bob</font>
<p><font size=3D2 color=3D#000080 face=3D"Arial"> </font>
<p><font size=3D2 color=3D#000080 face=3D"Arial">I have a 1987 Frers 33 that
sails and races on the Chesapeake Bay. I’ve read Frank’s =
response
on your question 4 and only have a couple of things to add, based on my
experience:</font>
<p><font size=3D2 color=3D#000080 face=3D"Arial"> </font>
<p><font size=3D2 color=3D#000080 face=3D"Arial">The construction of the tr=
ansverse
stringer leaves a void below the stringer that extends to the leading edge
of the keel sump to which the keel is bolted at the point of transition
into the hull. I don’t know for certain if this will be true on
all boats, as I understand some may not have wood in the stringers, but
where it exists, it creates a potential structural weak point. =
If
the leading edge of the keel at the hull shows separation you will get
a leak that will not only contribute to deterioration of the wood stringer,
but provides a path to the bilge: the reason is that you are not seeing
separation between keel and hull, but a crack in the sump which, over time
and load can create a tear in the hull. This is one reason a fix
from the inside is desirable and that you should look carefully at the
leading edge of the keel at the hull. The fix is not as traumatic
as the problem sounds. The other thing to check is the keel bolts
for deep crevice corrosion, as on at least one boat (mine) there was a
mismatch between stainless in the bolts and nuts that caused substantial
erosion of several of the keel bolts.</font>
<p><font size=3D2 color=3D#000080 face=3D"Arial"> </font>
<p><font size=3D2 color=3D#000080 face=3D"Arial">Other than that, the boat =
is
strong as an ox and a delight to sail and race.</font>
<p><font size=3D2 color=3D#000080 face=3D"Arial"> </font>
<br><font size=3D3 color=3D#000080 face=3D"Arial">Allan M. Heyward, Jr.</fo=
nt>
<br><font size=3D2 color=3D#000080 face=3D"Arial">COOK, HEYWARD, LEE, HOPPER
& FEEHAN, P.C.</font>
<br><font size=3D2 color=3D#000080 face=3D"Arial">804-747-4500</font>
<p><font size=3D2 color=3D#000080 face=3D"Arial"> </font>
<p><font size=3D2 face=3D"Tahoma">-----Original Message-----<b><br>
From:</b> frers-list-admin@lists.frers33.com [mailto:frers-list-admin@lists=
.frers33.com]
<b>On Behalf Of </b>Stephen, Robert<b><br>
Sent:</b> Wednesday, February 01, 2006 7:02 AM<b><br>
To:</b> frers-list@lists.frers33.com<b><br>
Subject:</b> [frers-list]questions on a purchase of a frers 33</font>
<p><font size=3D3 face=3D"Times New Roman"> </font>
<p><font size=3D2 face=3D"Arial">I am currently interested in purchasing a
frers 33.</font>
<p><font size=3D2 face=3D"Arial"> </font>
<p><font size=3D2 face=3D"Arial">1)</font><font size=3D1> &nb=
sp;
</font><font size=3D2 face=3D"Arial">Can anyone update me as to where any s=
pecific
coring issues in hull or the deck area that might be consistent with most
of these boats?</font>
<p><font size=3D2 face=3D"Arial">2)</font><font size=3D1> &nb=
sp;
</font><font size=3D2 face=3D"Arial">If I wanted to change out the wheel st=
eering
to a tiller is this reasonable or does the installation look like a morphid=
ite?</font>
<p><font size=3D2 face=3D"Arial">3)</font><font size=3D1> &nb=
sp;
</font><font size=3D2 face=3D"Arial">Any questionable electrical to look fo=
r?</font>
<p><font size=3D2 face=3D"Arial">4)</font><font size=3D1> &nb=
sp;
</font><font size=3D2 face=3D"Arial">Any concern on the design as it relates
to the keel to hull design or attachment. Separate from a bad grounding.</f=
ont>
<p><font size=3D2 face=3D"Arial"> </font>
<p><font size=3D2 face=3D"Arial"> </font>
<p><font size=3D2 face=3D"Arial">I live in the Chicago area</font>
<p><font size=3D2 face=3D"Arial">Thanks for any advice or information anyone
can offer on “what to look for”</font>
<p><font size=3D2 face=3D"Arial"> </font>
<p><font size=3D2 face=3D"Arial">Bob</font>
<p><font size=3D2 face=3D"Arial">
</font>
<p><font size=3D2 color=3Dblue face=3D"Arial"><br>
=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=
=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=
=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=
=5F=5F<br>
CONFIDENTIALITY NOTE:<br>
This Weber-Stephen Products Company e-mail is intended only for<br>
the use of the individual or entity to which it is addressed and may<br>
contain information that is privileged, confidential and exempt from<br>
disclosure under applicable law. If the reader of this e-mail message<br>
is not the intended recipient, or the employee or agent responsible<br>
for delivery of the message to the intended recipient, you are hereby<br>
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communication is prohibited. If you have received this e-mail in error,<br>
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